Really Jack?

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Well no shit. 

Westerneagle Said:

DirtyMike Said:
Westerneagle, when did you find time from holding your sign that says "the world is ending" to reply to me?

Didn't say the world was ending, simply that there will be a Last Day.


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So its not the individual's right to determine when or when they can be determined an individual?  Regardless of how a pregnancy happens there is going to be life(or at least the chance at life).  The circumstances of the pregnancy do not determine the value of that life in my opinion.  This is where we differ.  It may increase taxes or welfare costs to take care of these children because of deadbeat parents.  But I would gladly pay them vs having the blood or cells of that life on my hands.

Secondly, I call an abdomen a stomache.  Sorry.

Thirdly, I have been assaulted outside of a bar in Minot, in front of Police, and yes it is a class B misdemeanor.

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 i've asked this before.  but, i think it leads to some self reflection... i know it did with me anyway.  where do all of you 100% pro-lifers stand on the issue of embryos sitting in a lab somewhere?  essentially fertilized eggs that have multiplied a few times.  if you say you can't throw them in the garbage, then what is a guy to do with them?  to take that position, means you essentially take the position that there should never be fertilization treatment.  keep in mind there is no "life" per say with those embryos... they are a frozen clump of cells sitting in a petri dish or a test tube someplace.  and does it change your position just because that same clump of cells happens to be in a uterus?  at what point does it no longer become a clump of cells and becomes worthy of the same protection as a human life?  things worth pondering.

another one... how about the case of severe birth defects?  the type that would mean almost zero chance of making it to term or death within a very short time period if they did or the type that place the life of the mother in severe danger?

i don't support abortion.  but, it certainly isn't so black and white for me.  i think there needs to be exceptions in severe cases and i also wouldn't give the clump of cells sitting in an lab some place the same level of protection i would give a fetus in the womb at say 12 weeks once its spinal neuro system has began to develop.  

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DirtyMike Said:

skeeterguy Said:

DirtyMike Said:
It's not an individual and it's not murder.  Once I see pregnant women who have either smoked or drank while pregnant get strung up on attempted murder charges (assuming they gave birth to something with a heartbeat), I'll start agreeing with you. 

Ok, Let's take another angle to this.  Lets say that you and your wife have tried to have a baby for a couple years.  You finally succeeded and everything is going smoothly.  You get an ultrasound an the baby is doing great.  You find out the sex of the baby and set up your baby room to greet this bundle of joy when it comes home from the hospital.  Everything is all set, the baby room, the changing table, the formula, the diapers, and the thoughts of love that you will have for your own child.  The baby is due in one week.  Your wife decides to go to the grocery store to get some things for supper.  Some maniac comes up to her in the parking lot and boots her in the stomache like he's kicking a 50 yard field goal.  Your baby dies!  Your wife lives.  Your whole world is shattered.  Is that baby not an individual?  Is that not murder? The baby that you and your wife had anticipated is dead and the guy that kicked your wife in the stomache gets off with a Class B misdemeanor and walks free.  Now correct me if I am wrong.  In your opinion this is not yet an individual.  Therefore you were never a father.  Therefore you shouldn't be upset about anything except someone kicking your wife in the stomache. Because there was no murder committed according to you. 
  That my friend is what I mean about being a good human being.  So if you think abortion is OK and its a woman's right to do as she pleases with her body, then "YES" I am saying that you are a bad person.

Very well thought out and written, Skeeter.  I see your point, but I don't agree 100%.  First, the fetus you are talking about has reached term and could live if parted from the mother.  Here's where I can get on board with you in that, there needs to be a set date of when an abortion can happen.  Some people will go off of a timeline of "when life begins."  A baby at 37 weeks is viable, therefor, and individual.

 
Second, since said baby is carried to term, the maniac could be charged for two counts of attempted murder, or two counts of 1st degree murder, or one of each depending on the outcome.  A woman that is 9 months pregnant gets kicked in the abdomen (that's where the uterus is located, not the stomach), there's a good chance of arterial bleeding, most likely causing both individuals to expire. 

Third, a class B misdemeanor for Assault? I know guys that have been charged with felonies for knocking out a the smart ass tough guy outside the bar. 

Lastly, like I said, I can see where you are coming from.  but linking abortion to such a terrible crime that you've described, sounds like you're reaching. 

/26/2013 4:16 PM | Reply #92 | "Quote" | "Quick Reply" |
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So its not the individual's right to determine when or when they can be determined an individual? Regardless of how a pregnancy happens there is going to be life(or at least the chance at life). The circumstances of the pregnancy do not determine the value of that life in my opinion. This is where we differ. It may increase taxes or welfare costs to take care of these children because of deadbeat parents. But I would gladly pay them vs having the blood or cells of that life on my hands.

Secondly, I call an abdomen a stomache. Sorry.

Thirdly, I have been assaulted outside of a bar in Minot, in front of Police, and yes it is a class B misdemeanor.

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Sorry, it got cut off.

So its not the individual's right to determine when or when they can be determined an individual? Regardless of how a pregnancy happens there is going to be life(or at least the chance at life). The circumstances of the pregnancy do not determine the value of that life in my opinion. This is where we differ. It may increase taxes or welfare costs to take care of these children because of deadbeat parents. But I would gladly pay them vs having the blood or cells of that life on my hands.

Secondly, I call an abdomen a stomache. Sorry.

Thirdly, I have been assaulted outside of a bar in Minot, in front of Police, and yes it is a class B misdemeanor.

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The comments here are ridiculous, for the most part. "It" is a living child, albeit just a heartbeat to hear for now.

And the biggest gripe on here is how much it's going to cost? Gimme a break. If someone were to say any one of you was too much expense to be worth it, I bet you'd have thought differently. Not to mention that the promised appeals from the pro-choice (pro abortion) side state "our appeals are going to be too many and too expensive for the state to win".

What does that mean? I mean really? So, do I interpret that to mean that "we're right because it's too expensive to prove us wrong".

Shame on you guys. And Tim, on this, I'm with you.

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never thought a website based on the outdoors would have come to this

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 Anyone ever tried Rotel in tater tot hotdish??

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Another thing. After my wife and I had our second child, she was diagnosed with colon cancer, and shortly thereafter had to have a total hysterectomy. So, for us, no more biological children. We are now starting down the road of adoption and when looking at the MOUNTAINS of paperwork, months or possibly years of waiting, and not-inconsiderable expense, the thought of people aborting babies makes my heart ache. There are many people in my/our position, who would love and welcome a child, and there are others (you can't deny that sometimes this happens) don't want the inconvenience.

That is a shame.

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Rotel in tater.. that's funny. I gotta get less serious. My blood pressure...

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jaykay Said:
Another thing. After my wife and I had our second child, she was diagnosed with colon cancer, and shortly thereafter had to have a total hysterectomy. So, for us, no more biological children. We are now starting down the road of adoption and when looking at the MOUNTAINS of paperwork, months or possibly years of waiting, and not-inconsiderable expense, the thought of people aborting babies makes my heart ache. There are many people in my/our position, who would love and welcome a child, and there are others (you can't deny that sometimes this happens) don't want the inconvenience.

That is a shame.

I think that is a big thing to consider. I wish we would stop paying people to have babies that keep them and refuse to raise them while so many other just want the opportinity to raise children in a manner that at least gives them a chance.

I dont go around guessing cup sizes either I just know a nice rack when I see one.

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 I am against abortion because I believe it is impossible for me to know when life begins.  Does it start when the baby is born?  What about a month before that?  Is it when a baby can live outside the womb which today is before 20 weeks?  Is it when the heart beats?  To me its about respect for life.

I have to laugh when some of you say "I'm personally against abortion but I can't say what a woman can do with her body".   If you are against abortion, than you must be against it because you believe it is a human.  If it is indeed a human, how can you say it is alright for a women to kill it.  It may be in her body but it certainly is another person.

For you that are for abortion, where do you draw the line and why?  Is it OK to abort a baby at 9 months?  Why not?  Is it OK to kill a one month old child?  Why not?  Is not an 8 month baby in the womb just as much a human as a child that was out of the womb for one month?  What is the difference?

And while it may be hard for a woman to go through a pregnancy with a child from a rape, is it right for her to abort the baby?  It is not that baby's fault that it was created.  Why must we let it be killed?

It's far too easy for people to say they are for abortion.  I don't think many have thought these questions through.  If so, please educate me.  Please tell me when life starts and what the difference is between a one month child and one that is one month from being born.  I want to know.

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2Bhunting Said:
So now you are just going to vote Democrat?

Looks a lot better after today.  And no I won't apologize for that.  I guess I'll just cancel out your vote next time if you are going to vote for those same backward legislators and our dumbass governor again.

Voting democrat would be like getting an abortion.   You will have to live with the gilt and regret of both actions the rest of your life

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doublebarrelsaloon Said:

jaykay Said:
Another thing. After my wife and I had our second child, she was diagnosed with colon cancer, and shortly thereafter had to have a total hysterectomy. So, for us, no more biological children. We are now starting down the road of adoption and when looking at the MOUNTAINS of paperwork, months or possibly years of waiting, and not-inconsiderable expense, the thought of people aborting babies makes my heart ache. There are many people in my/our position, who would love and welcome a child, and there are others (you can't deny that sometimes this happens) don't want the inconvenience.

That is a shame.

I think that is a big thing to consider. I wish we would stop paying people to have babies that keep them and refuse to raise them while so many other just want the opportinity to raise children in a manner that at least gives them a chance.

It took my parents years to adopt they said.  Not an easy process and there are lots of people praying for the chance to adopt.  Meanwhile not only are abortion happening, most of the population supports it.  We have a meltdown occuring in our society.

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You know, with all the debate on this subject from a variety of angles, there seems to be one thing people on both sides forget.....unwanted pregnancy is 100% preventable if one so chooses.

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Enslow Said:

doublebarrelsaloon Said:

jaykay Said:
Another thing. After my wife and I had our second child, she was diagnosed with colon cancer, and shortly thereafter had to have a total hysterectomy. So, for us, no more biological children. We are now starting down the road of adoption and when looking at the MOUNTAINS of paperwork, months or possibly years of waiting, and not-inconsiderable expense, the thought of people aborting babies makes my heart ache. There are many people in my/our position, who would love and welcome a child, and there are others (you can't deny that sometimes this happens) don't want the inconvenience.

That is a shame.

I think that is a big thing to consider. I wish we would stop paying people to have babies that keep them and refuse to raise them while so many other just want the opportinity to raise children in a manner that at least gives them a chance.

It took my parents years to adopt they said.  Not an easy process and there are lots of people praying for the chance to adopt.  Meanwhile not only are abortion happening, most of the population supports it.  We have a meltdown occuring in our society.

I do believe adoption should be a difficult thing considering what we are dealing with and considering the outcome is worth it. What I do find shameful however is how many children are being born and being treated like garbage by their parents who get a blindly written check for it.  It does sound hypocritical though that children are protected so much on the adoption side yet left in the gutter on the other.

I dont go around guessing cup sizes either I just know a nice rack when I see one.

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Musky, how in the case of rape is pregnancy 100% preventable?

 

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Or should the rape victim just plan ahead better?

 

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Enslow Said:
It took my parents years to adopt they said.  Not an easy process and there are lots of people praying for the chance to adopt.  Meanwhile not only are abortion happening, most of the population supports it.  We have a meltdown occuring in our society.

My father was adopted, had his biological mother been "pro choice" I wouldnt be here, my sister wouldnt, her 3 kids wouldnt, my 4 kids wouldnt, my granddaughter wouldnt....etc.

A pretty pathetic "choice" to be made.

Neat

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There is plan B. But, some consider that abortion too.

Born to hunt and fish... Forced to work!

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feather_duster Said:
 Anyone ever tried Rotel in tater tot hotdish??

nope but we picked up some JD Salsa mix at the Sportsman show ... and BAM that makes a great dip with Rotel diced tomaters ..


"Colorless green ideas sleep furiously"
...People who don’t understand sarcasm are awesome !?!
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multi-species-angler Said:
I should get a tax deduction for a vasectomy.

God, Family, Green Bay Packers!

Johnny 7

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MuskyManiac Said:
You know, with all the debate on this subject from a variety of angles, there seems to be one thing people on both sides forget.....unwanted pregnancy is 100% preventable if one so chooses.

And in this is where the road turns from Good into Evil.

 Mankinds downfall is thinking that just because he "knows" how to do something doesn't mean he should! 
That has been the battle since the beginning in the garden. Culture after culture, after culture sliding down a slippery slope of child sacrifice.
In studies it has been found that for every 100 cycles that a woman is on the pill, two to ten "children" are spontanously aborted because the fertilized egg is unable to attach itself to the wall of the uterus as it is thinned by the chemicals in the pill. 
So every eight years, two to ten "kids" have die because of a "choice" to take the pill. 
You are causing the death of a gift, and don't even know it!  Now you do! 
 
The Lord Blessed the Hebrews as they were the only culture in that region which did not practice Human Sacrifice. 

No wonder God wanted entire cultures decimated. 

As men gain "knowledge" they "fall" back to killing the most innocent of Human Beings who have no voice with which to protest. He hears their silent cries and He will extract Justice.
It is an archaeological fact that the Gentile cultures in the "Land" practiced various forms of human sacrifice, not just something written in a Book that some "choose" to not believe.

 Smile as from this day forward you can Choose Life.

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Tim, I take it you made your mind up now that you are pro life regardless of life of the mother? Because just a little while back you were torn on that issue. Now you shouldn't be torn because you don't really have a choice do you? Our state government just decided to make that choice for you.

 

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How come everyone is for less government control and personal responsibility until it comes to an issue like this?
 

I am not for abortion, can't imagine not having my kids. I was married to a gal who had an abortion when she was young before I knew her. As some have stated earlier it did haunt her relentlessly. She ended up having a complete nervous breakdown which I think her past helped contribute to.

But, that being said and I am the type of person who believes government should have a very small influence in my life. I don't think it's goverment's place to decide this issue, it should be between God, a priest, a woman, her family, etc. 

I wonder if we could better serve our wants by setting up booths by aborton clinics trying to tell woman that they have options. I know if we did this babies would be saved. If we paid for couples to tell woman walking into an abortion clinic that they would adopt their unborn babies I believe most of these women would have a change of heart.

But, you can't honestly believe in less government, less big-brother, the GOP way of thinking is the right way and then want government to step in and run this situation. Approach this problem from the private sector.You can't pick and choose wherther you are for big government or small govermnet depending on the issue.

If I am not mistaken ND only has one abortion clinic which is located in Fargo. If anyone would like to fund me---- food , wages, hotel, etc to man a spot outside of the clinic located in Farge or elsewhere I would be honored to spend my time trying to convince  women to take a different path.

But if we are truley a GOP state let's be true to our believes and keep goverment out of our lifes and this issue.

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 Great news! The Gov. Did the right thing!   He has more balls tha most to stand up for the defenseless and against the murder of the innocent.    If we cannot spend a few extra dollars to fight the immoral crazies that want to run your state, then we might as well roll over as a bunch of whimps.   

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Westerneagle Said:

MuskyManiac Said:
You know, with all the debate on this subject from a variety of angles, there seems to be one thing people on both sides forget.....unwanted pregnancy is 100% preventable if one so chooses.

And in this is where the road turns from Good into Evil.

 Mankinds downfall is thinking that just because he "knows" how to do something doesn't mean he should! 
That has been the battle since the beginning in the garden. Culture after culture, after culture sliding down a slippery slope of child sacrifice.
In studies it has been found that for every 100 cycles that a woman is on the pill, two to ten "children" are spontanously aborted because the fertilized egg is unable to attach itself to the wall of the uterus as it is thinned by the chemicals in the pill. 
So every eight years, two to ten "kids" have die because of a "choice" to take the pill. 
You are causing the death of a gift, and don't even know it!  Now you do! 
 
The Lord Blessed the Hebrews as they were the only culture in that region which did not practice Human Sacrifice. 

No wonder God wanted entire cultures decimated. 

As men gain "knowledge" they "fall" back to killing the most innocent of Human Beings who have no voice with which to protest. He hears their silent cries and He will extract Justice.
It is an archaeological fact that the Gentile cultures in the "Land" practiced various forms of human sacrifice, not just something written in a Book that some "choose" to not believe.

 Smile as from this day forward you can Choose Life.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

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RCwild00 Said:
This is great news as far as Im concerned. I dont mind the extra $10 i might pay extra in taxes to do what is right. I hope he gets to the white house and ends abortion and same sex marriage completely. Has anyone watched  The BIble series on the History channel the last few weeks? If we as country keep heading down the road we are currently on, we are all f'd.

Amen, brother!

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